TheByte

Choleric

Democratic Candidates

Joe Biden U.S. Senator - Deleware


Six term Senator Serving since 1972
Chairman of U.S. Senate Committee on Foreign Relations
Serves On U.S. Senate Committee on the Judiciary

Hillary Clinton U.S. Senator - New York


Two term senator serving since 2000
Former First Lady

Christopher Dodd U.S. Senator - Connecticut


U.S. Representative from 1975-1981
Five term Senator serving since 1980

Chairman of Senate Banking Commmittee

John Edwards Former U.S. Senator - North Carolina


Trial Lawyer
One term Senator, served from 1998-2004
Ran for Presidency in 2004, eventualy nominated as Vice President

Mike Gravel Former U.S. Senator - Alaska


Two term Senator, served from 1968-1980
Ended the draft, through a filibuster following Vietnam
Put the Pentagon Papers into public record in 1971

Dennis Kucinich U.S. Representative - Ohio


Six term U.S. Representative serving since 1996
Former Mayor of Cleveland

Chairman of the Domestic Policy Subcommittee of the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform

Barack Obama U.S. Senator - Illinois


One term Senator serving since 2004
Served in Illinois State Senate from 1997-2004

Bill Richardson Governor - New Mexico


Governor since 2003
U.S. Secretary of Energy 1998-2001
Served as Ambassador to United Nations 1997-1998


Republican Candidates

Sam Brownback U.S. Senator - Kansas


Two term Senator serving since 1998

Rudy Giuliani Former Mayor - New York City


Mayor from 1994-2002

Mike Huckabee Former Governor - Arkansas


Governor from 1996-2007

Duncan Hunter U.S. Representative - California


U.S. Representative since 1981
Chairman of House Armed Services Committee from 2002-2006

John McCain U.S. Senator - Arizona


Four term Senator serving since 1986
Two term U.S. Representative, served from 1982-1986
Lost nomination for President in 2000 to George W. Bush

Vietnam Veteran and P.O.W.

Ron Paul U.S. Representative - Texas


Ten term Congressman serving since 1978-1985 and 1996-to present

Mitt Romney Former Governor - Massachusetts


One term Governor, served 2002-2006
Ran unsuccesfully for Senate in 1994
Credited with reviving 2002 Salt Lake City Winter Olympics from bankruptcy

Tom Tancredo U.S. Representative - Colorado


Five term Congressman serving since 1998

Tommy Thompson Former Secretary of Health and Human Services


Secretary of Health and Human Services from 2001-2005
Former Governor of Wisconsin, 1986-2001

The Artist

wow can we talk politics here..thats hot

anyways.. i think the world has had enough of republicans for a decade..
so im with the democrats..
Obama.. is the one i voted for.. cause i really just know about him and hilary..not much about the others..

anyways my vote doesent say anything..as im not a US citizen

Choleric

We can, but it still has to be civil. In other words people can argue but do it in a civil, non-threatening, intellectual way.

Personally I support Joe Biden as of right now, He is a experienced politician, yet is still down to earth and can connect with the average person and he isn't afraid to speak his mind. Most Importantly he has a plan for Iraq.

Michael

At this moment I do not know who I support. I am a registered Democrat, but politics is not my thing. To me, they all have facades and the bottom line is to get votes. I am not into this election as I was into the Kerry election. I really wanted John Kerry to be voted in. I am sick and tired of ignorant people running the country I live in. There is another thread on this forum in reference to whether you are proud of your country. I hate that people call Americans ignorant, because I personally do not consider myself that. I have to blame the administration, and our President, because he truly has made us Americans look so ignorant, that we come off as arrogant people.

I studied International Relations and there was nothing more worthwhile for me than in learning about different cultures and conflicts. I truly hate the fact that our President, in a way, has to represent the American people. I truly feel that President Bush does not do this whatsoever.

We need a President, whether it be a woman or a man, to stand up and take care of issues concerning our country. We need to change America and put it on a course to better it. I know that countries suffer from different beliefs. At the end of the day we are all human. Nevertheless, there are real issuses domestically that have to be tackled. We need an immigration bill. We also need better healthcare and we need to be less dependent on oil and other countries for goods. We need to start thinking about our future and plan accordingly, and finally, I think we need to step back and disconnect. We are running out fuel, no pun intended, and we will eventually find ourselves not being a world leader, or 2nd to one. We need to return to the caring and helpful American both domestically and internationally.

Rob

The only problem I have with the Democrats is their hypocrisy over Iraq ...lets not forget they supported the war too.

I am agitated by talks of pulling out of Iraq soon ....it is obvious the Americans will blame any failure of the state (after they leave) on president Jalal Talabani and the democratically elected government of Iraq.

America and its allies caused the instability in Iraq, walking out now will make Iraq a bigger threat to the USA than it ever was under Saddam, IMO they have a duty to stay and protect the Iraqi government from radicals who will destroy it five minutes after the troops leave.

Choleric

They supported the war because they were misled by false information, and the White House and GOP controlled Congress pushed along legislation so quickly that the information was never looked over or scrutinized before it was too late.


Their government is telling us we can leave, what more do you want? And that is a little presumptious to assume that all Americans will blame the Iraqi state for the ensuing fiasco.

A duty to stay and protect the Iraqi government huh? How are we supposed to do that? We can't even do that now. The only way to 'protect' Iraq is to fully occupy that country with a full out U.S. Military run state, 24/7 martial law, with at least ±1million troops, like Germany after WWII, and that will never happen. So instead of half assing it, waiting and wishing things will get better magically, we need to get our troops home, and stop having them die for a misled cause.

We are trying to force Democracy down the Iraqi's throats. And we are trying to force three groups of people who having been fighting for hundreds of years all to live together in harmony. Either split Iraq up into three seperate nation-states, or form a weak Federal state with three strong provinces/states(i.e. Biden's plan).

And this War on terror shit is really getting on my nerves. It has practically been a free pass for the White House to do as they please in order to "protect" America. And We are only helping Al Qaeda and other Terrorists by staying in the Middle East. The longer we are there, the more ammunition they have for recruitment. The angrier the average people get and the more leniant and sympathetic they are to the terrorists. Al Qaeda was never even in Iraq before we deposed Saddam, we created a safe haven for them and a front where they can directly attack our troops.

We need to just worry about our own damn country, fix the problems here and stop trying to fix the problems that are convenient for us to fix elsewhere.

Education needs dire attention, as does healthcare and immigration.

This presidency is a shame, 1/20/09 cannot come quick enough.

Rob

Which false information exactly?

Yeah, Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki has said the US can leave any time it wants -- I wonder if he will be quite so bold when the militants come to cut his head off.

They are already setting that up ....more and more we are seeing blame for failure being placed on the Iraqi government itself.

Well then, America shouldn't start wars it can't finish.

The Iraqi people were not "forced" to participate in their elections .....millions of Iraqis willingly and eagerly embraced their right to vote for the government of their choice ....in spite of threats from radicals. I am tired of this crap that some cultures just are not compatible with democracy -- that is simply buying into the propaganda of those who would like to control Iraq.


You are right Jeff, maybe splitting the country is the only answer.

Huh, tell me about it.

Yeah, it is true ....but Americans seem to find it hard to come to terms with the fact that their nation is at war here ......pulling out of Iraq will not lesson the risk of terrorist attacks on US soil -- there will be more attcaks, of that we can be almost certain.

Well we don't know that for sure. It is true that Saddam was not popular with his neighbours ...but after 911 the Whitehouse was extremely paranoid about everything going on in the Middle East ....and Saddam had recently rediscovered Islam, obviously in order to gain sympathy with Muslims who might be sympathetic to a fellow Muslim being threatened by the infidel west.

Sure, I believe that is true ...but just because America pulls out of Iraq doesn't make the problems go away -- America has many enemies .....if your country buries its head in the sand, you will pay a big price. Bush is not a wise man but he is not quite as ignorant as he is often portryed either.

Sure, all those domestic things are very important too, but as I said above, America cannot just ignore the threat from its enemies ....your country is, in fact, at war.

Choleric

Oops, sorry I forgot about those Weapons of Mass Destruction we found...

Their parliment also voted for us to leave. You yourself said millions of Iraqi's willing voted to elect these people, they speak for the people, then yes blame is going to be put on the Iraqi government when we leave and shit hits the fan.



Exactly, Only an ignorant fool would have thought we could just be in and out, who was it who coined 'Mission Accomplished' again?

No they were not forced, but we forced the change, we completley removed the government and tried initiating Democracy from the top down. If the people really wanted/ready for it, it would have come from the bottom up, which, historically is more succesful. Plus lets be honest, would the United States really sit around and let the people form a socialist or communist state, if that is what they chose?

and I never said any culture was not compatiable with democracy.

We are not at war, the American people do not feel any reprecussions of Iraq, they go about life just the same as before, unless of course they have loved ones fighting over seas.

Pulling out of Iraq does not garuntee that attacks will be more likely than if we were to stay.

well, we can speculate all we want but, at least when he was there Iraq was a stable country, and we had a head figure to open dialouge with as opposed to the enemies we are fighting now.

Of course we should not completely ignore everyone else. I was saying that we need to stop intervening where it is convenient fo us. We need to concentrate on helping not fighting, our efforts would have been much more beneficial in Africa, especially Sudan or the Congo.

We are not at war. This 'war' on terror is nothing but fearmongering. The focus needs to be on Domestic issues.

Rob

LOL ....well yes ....but every intellegence agency in the world believed they existed once.

nothing to comment ......I do agree with you Jeff.


Yeah Bush was stupid doing that ......but let us not forget that going in to this "War On Terror" Bush never said it would be over quickly .....he has always stated that America (and its allies) face a long-term war that could last decades -- it seems the war on terror was fine with Americans until it started encroaching on their comfortable lives. I saw an episode of "sweet 16" yesterday: an American TV show where daughters of wealthy Americans have outrageously conspicuous birthday parties which cost $100,000+ -- I know this is not a fair representation of America's youth, but it looked extremely self-absorbed from a foreign perspective. One girl was complaining because she wanted a CLK convertible for here birthday and her father suggested a VW Beetle would be a better first car, I felt like saying "Honey, don't you know there's a war going on"


Yeah, I am not arguing with you Jeff ....but the government the Iraqis voted was not the one the US would have liked anyway.

-- yeah sorry, I know you didn't say that -- I was just making that extra point


...and you see, that is one thing that really pisses the rest of the world off -- it's not just the US government's war, the American people (and other western nations) are seen as self-absorbed and self-indulgent -- where rampant consumerism is of far more importance than what goes on in the rest of the world.

No, but it is almost certain that the Iraqi government will fall ....with Iran and Syria likely having a great influence over Iraq ...a situation that could be very dangerous to other Muslim countries in the region (Qatar, UAE, Egypt, etc) ...and certainly will cause great anxiety for Israel.

Well it is a difficult thing. It is hard to know what is right or wrong here. Saddam was a monster responsible for many terrible crimes against his own people ....but his departure has caused far more problems than the Bush administration ever dreamed of (in spite of being warned by many academics and even Colin Powell)

I agree Jeff. America is a wonderful country ....Europeans are often very quick to criticize the US, but they also look firstly to the US whenever things need to be done: "where are the Americans?" "Why don't the Americans do something". America is damned if it does and damned if it doesn't. I guess that is the price of being the most powerful nation on Earth.

I can tell you one thing for a fact though, I would rather have the US as the "World's Policeman" than say, China.

If the world thinks the US government is a big bully .....wait till they get a taste of the Chinese Communist Party.


Jeff, your country is at war ....Christ, over 1 million US troops have served in the middle east since 911 ....and around 2000 have died (as far as I know). Tell the people of Afghanistan and Iraq than the US is not at war, I'm sure they would be interested to know that.

The Artist

2000 us troops dead from 2000 to now..
lol that can not be true..
the ppl they are attacking arent sitting with nailpolish on their hands exactly..
come on man..